Addae: A whole conversation! A whole conversation!
Jordan: And I know that dramaturgy itself is in a moment, but then not having a moment. So anyways, I just would love to hear about the impetus to create a space for Black playwrights to develop new works and there’s a lot of rules of engagement that you all have there that I just would love for you to share.
Addae: Yeah. Yeah. Amina and I—having been in a lot of development rooms on plays by written by Black writers and white writers as well, as a dramaturg, as a playwright—I think what we started to notice was that one, there were very few predominantly Black spaces that felt comfortable and felt like family, like you were actually engaged with these people who understood you. You did not have to explain yourself or your process to them, and you can all get together and help shape a world in terms of the piece you were working on.
We had very few of those experiences in our own development experiences, both as playwrights and dramaturgs. And so we started thinking, it’s like, “What would it be like to have a new play development company that really focused on a process?” A process that we’re still shaping, a process in a way of developing Black plays. Particularly developing Black plays for Black audiences, but also developing Black plays for Black audiences that weren’t necessarily social realism or kitchen table realism. Because they love to put Black folks in the past. They love to put us through something that’s super-hyper realistic. Where are the spaces for Black writers who don’t write like that, but also want to center a Black audience? And there wasn’t a space so we decided that we wanted to create that space.
And also two, there’s so few opportunities for folks who didn’t go to graduate school, who aren’t at MFA programs and who were Black storytellers, there’s so many things for them to develop their work. One of the things that we’re really pushing towards now is like, “How do we get folks?” And this is something I’m thinking about, and even the work I do at Theatrical Outfit in terms of new play development: how do you get people in the room who aren’t in graduate programs? Because I think one of the things that’s missing from Black drama is non-academic Black voices. That’s also something that we’re really focusing on now with Hush Harbor Lab.
The whole idea of a Hush Harbor, hush harbors were these spaces, these sacred spaces, deep in the woods that Black folks would congregate to during the era of enslavement. It gave them a safe space to be themselves away from the enslaver’s gaze. We really think about what happens when you create or have a space for Black artists to create their work outside of the gaze of white American theatre.
Leticia: One, wow. This next question that we have is a big question, and I think you’ve actually done it throughout our conversation. But what is the state of Black theatre, and where do you see it going or where do you want it to go?
Addae: We are in a state. Even though I was born in 1971, I really consider myself in a lot of ways, aesthetically, a child of the Black Arts Movement. One of the main things I think a lot of the artists in the Black Arts Movement were trying to do with the work that they we’re creating, whether it was poetry or the novel or drama, dramatic literature, is that I want us to create theatre that is as compelling and rich and complex as Black music is.
For me in a lot of ways, Black music is the pinnacle of our creative expression, because all the complexities of who we are, all of our identities are expressed in the music. As an artist, I want something that bumps as hard and is as messy and problematic and engaging as Kendrick’s new album. I want that on stage. I want to see that on stage. I think if we want our people to engage in the work that we create, we really have to start thinking about how can we make this as rich and as complex and as intriguing as the music that we create.
Leticia: And it also makes me think of Jordan’s work, and specifically the form of musical theatre. We’ve talked about this a bit on the podcast in the past, but the hostile terrain of musical theatre as a form for Black folks. If Black music is the pinnacle of the complexity of Blackness and Black people, and then we have this form musical theatre where dance, music, and theatre collide, what are the possibilities there? And of course, Jordan, you’re doing the good work of showing how Black, specifically Black women creators, are using that form in amazing ways, even in the past. But it just made me think of that. Like, “Ah, is there an untapped potential potentially that Black theatre has not tapped into yet?”
Addae: Ntozake Shange set the blueprint. That brilliant essay from Three Pieces, in that essay Zake said, “I ain’t going to create no theatre that doesn’t include Black dance and Black music.” And she pretty much stuck to that throughout the cannon of her work, but also Baraka was doing the same thing with his work. Adrienne Kennedy, she would have Archie Shepp compose the music for her plays in her original productions. It’s not even a new thing. But I feel like, again, which is why I love y’all and I love this show, if we don’t tap into our own history and really understand the full history of especially Black American drama, we won’t understand that all the shit that we want to do has been done already. It’s a matter of us uplifting it and incorporating these techniques to the work that we create now.
Jordan: I totally agree. I think that I really… I love that connection between music and theatre. I find music to be one of the most important things just to me in general. I think your question of… I think it’s a really great dramaturgical question, and I think that it is really important to consider this thing, this cultural creation of Black music, which is the lifeblood of African American life. And how best to take what you said, the richness of that and put it everywhere. Theatre, yes. Everywhere, literature, film, TV, all of it.
How do we capture what has been so beautiful about that form in all of these different artistic mediums? We have a fun question, or at least we hope it’s a fun question, but we know that Hush Harbor Lab focuses on new plays. There’s no dream play because that play has not yet been written or it is still in process. But in terms of your… If there’s a play that you would love to direct or you would love to produce in some way, is there a dream play that you’ve always wanted to work on that you haven’t had the chance to yet?
Addae: It’s funny because I’m actually… So I also work with this group called Working Title Playwrights, which Jordan has been a part of, and Working Title has their new dramaturgical cohort. I’m going to do a workshop session, and I’m excited because I get a chance to focus on a play that is probably one of my favorite plays, and that’s The Mojo and the Sayso by Aishah Rahman. And that is a play that I have been dying to direct. I saw a production of it at ETA in Chicago almost twenty years ago. It absolutely blew my mind. That’s definitely a play that at some point before I transition that I want to direct.
Leticia: We are so grateful that we get to engage in conversation with you and that we get to have this conversation recorded because we’ve talked prior about Black theatre and our thoughts. But we actually want to take a moment to uplift you and ask you, what are your next projects? What are you working on? Plug yourself is basically what we’re saying.
Addae: So, I am working on a play that’s going to incorporate music in some form or fashion. I don’t know if I’m comfortable calling it a musical, but it is a play that centers on a group of HBCU students at the turn of the twentieth century who are dealing with ideas of both identity politics and respectability politics. As it relates to a particular theatre program that was started by Adrienne Herndon, and they would perform Shakespeare every summer. And so these students decide to rebel, and they want to do a cabaret show instead at a whorehouse. I will incorporate ragtime and trap music and really deal with the messiness of Black class and Black class politics in the early twentieth century.
Leticia: It sounds like Jordan, we going to have to… Well, that’s home for you, but I’m going to have to get on some plane or train.
Addae: Jordan be getting a phone call—part of the process—once I get this done.
Jordan: I’ve always… I love, when you said trap music, my ears immediately perked up, because I’m like, I always thought, I’m like, “Why hasn’t that been…”
Addae: “Why hasn’t it been a trap musical?”
Jordan: Yes, yes. We have a trap museum. We got a trap escape room. We got a trap escape room. Where’s the trap musical. It’s like—
Addae: We got trap brunches, trap yoga.
Jordan: We’re trapped, we’re trapped. We need a trap musical. In the spirit of our guest, Addae being with us, we want to pass the mic and see if there’s any recommendations he might have for our listeners to engage further with either anything you talked about today or other things beyond that.
Addae: Actually, there are and they’re all on the floor next to me. Because I’ve been reading them. This is amazing book of folklore writings by Zora Neale Hurston called The Sanctified Church that I’ve been going back to recently time and time again. Because I think there’s a lot of interesting theoretical things in Zora’s folklore writing that can totally be applied to the theatre that we create. That’s one thing.
I was talking about music and the blues, and it’s a great book called The Bluesman by Julio Finn that talks about the blues as possibly the spiritual music for Hoodoo culture. It talks about ritual and sound and these performance aesthetics too that are super interesting. I’ve also been revisiting one of my favorite books, Nommo Drama [The Drama of Nommo] by Paul Carter Harrison which I still think is the aesthetics or the poetics of Black theatre. That’s one I’ve been looking at.
I was talking about Moon Marked—I was talking about Mojo and the Sayso and a part of that class that I’m teaching, I’m going to focus on the brilliant anthology—Moon Marked and Touched By Sun, which is hands down, my favorite theatre anthology edited by the brilliant Sydné Mahone, and her essay at the beginning of that book is still a really important reference point for me because it really focuses on the fact that in terms of Black dramaturgy and Black narrative innovation, it’s always been the systems. The systems have always been the one that have pushed it. Probably starting with… I would say starting with Grimké but also like Marita Bonner as well. Those would be my recommendations if had any.
Jordan: Yes, those are amazing recommendations. I’m writing about Zora Neale Hurston in my dissertation, and I have not read The Sanctified Church. I need to get on that.
Addae: Get on it. Get on it.
Jordan: Oh my goodness, Addae, I’m so happy that you were able to join us for this episode. This has been such an honor and a pleasure.
Addae: And also got to shout out y’all, because y’all doing that my grandma would say, y’all doing that “good colored work” out here these podcast streets. Because your podcast has been so helpful for any of us who are teaching African American theatre. It’s been a wonderful contribution and I just want to encourage y’all to keep doing it, keep doing that good colored work.
Jordan: Thank you so much. That means so much to us. Well y’all, we have so many more episodes coming up this season that are hopefully going to blow your minds like this one is going to so please stay with us. We have so much exciting things coming up. Thank you again to Addae for joining us today. And we’ll see y’all next time.
Leticia: This has been another episode of Daughters of Lorraine. We’re your hosts, Leticia Ridley—
Jordan: And Jordan Ealey. On our next episode, we’ll discuss the life, legacy, and work of Micki Grant. You definitely won’t want to miss this. In the meantime, if you’re looking to connect with us, please follow us on Twitter @dolorrainepod. P-O-D. You can also email us at daughtersoflorraine@gmail.com for further contact.
Leticia: The Daughters of Lorraine Podcast is produced as a contribution to HowlRound Theatre Commons. You can find more episodes of this series and other HowlRound podcasts in our feed on iTunes, Google Podcasts, Spotify, and wherever you find podcasts. Be sure to search “HowlRound Theatre Commons podcast” and subscribe to receive new episodes.
Jordan: If you loved this podcast, post a rating and write review on those platforms. This helps other people find us. You can also find a transcript for this episode, along with a lot of other progressive and disruptive content, on howlround.com. Have an idea for an exciting podcast essay or TV event the theatre community needs to hear? Visit howlround.com and submit your ideas to the commons.
